S4E5 of Tatreez Talk: Homemaking & Heritage With Jennifer and Christine
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This week on Tatreez Talk, Amanne and I got to sit down with two of our favorite stitchers—Jennifer and Christine—who we first met at the Tatreez Retreat in Yosemite. They’re sisters, beginners, and absolute joys to talk to. This conversation felt like the audio version of sitting in a living room together, stitching while talking about grief, identity, perfectionism, and Palestinian memory.
I loved this episode because it reminded me that you don’t have to be “advanced” to have something beautiful to say through your thread. Sometimes, just starting is the boldest thing. Below, you’ll find the show notes and timestamps so you can skip around—but I hope you listen all the way through.
Episode Shownotes
IN THIS EPISODE, WE’RE JOINED BY SISTERS JENNIFER AND CHRISTINE, WHO JOINED US THE TATREEZ RETREAT 2024 IN YOSEMITE. CHRISTINE IS AN AMATEUR TATREEZER, SPORTS ENTHUSIAST, AND ASPIRING CASUAL CRAFTER. JENNIFER IS AN AMATEUR TATREEZER TOO, AND AN AVID COOK AND HOMEMAKER (@__nif__). The conversation brings out so much joy in finding tatreez sisterhood and their relationship as sisters has fueled their shared creative pursuits.
For both Jennifer and Christine, they were drawn to tatreez through grief, nostalgia, and a desire to reclaim and connect with their roots. Jennifer, who is more rooted in homemaking, discusses how tatreez has become a meditative part of her day-to-day life. Christine, who juggles crafting with a busy life, shares how tatreez gives her space to reflect and create with intention, even when she doesn't feel “expert enough.”
They talk about perfectionism, beginner mindsets, and letting go of pressure. Christine talks about revisiting her thobe design and embracing the process rather than chasing a final product. The episode closes with a joyful energy, invitations to continue their thobe journeys, and a communal excitement about what’s next—especially with the upcoming retreat in Morocco in October 2025.
If you’re in Boston, get in touch with Jennifer to join the in-person tatreez circles!
You’ll hear about:
>> 1:33: Jennifer and Christine’s connection to Palestine
>> 14:51: Relationship with tatreez
>> 25:05: Cooking and tatreez at The Tatreez Retreat
>> 28:00: Finding Palestinian community through tatreez
>> 31:10: The impact of tatreez on Jennifer and Christine
>> 35:25: The stories they’re telling through tatreez
>> 43:00: Current tatreez works-in-progress
>> 46:53: Major life lessons from tatreez
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“I love Palestinian embroidery and Tatreez Talk.” <– If that sounds like you, please consider rating and reviewing our show! This helps us elevate the vibrant narratives of Palestinian embroiderers and support more tatreez-ers — just like you — in learning more about tatreez and connecting with each other. You can find us on Spotify, Apple Podcast, and others -- just scroll to the bottom, tap to rate with five stars, and select “Write a Review.” Then be sure to let us know what you loved most about the episode!
Also, if you haven’t done so already, follow the podcast. We’re adding a bunch of bonus episodes to the feed and, if you’re not following, there’s a good chance you’ll miss out. Follow now!
Links Mentioned
>> Jennifer and Christine’s first project from HBTatreez (Etsy, Instagram)
>> Link on Etsy to the design behind Christine’s latest Blooming Garden project
>> Join the tatreez circle in Boston through Arabs in Boston
Transcript
Lina: Hi stitchers! Welcome to Tatreez Talk where we share conversations about Palestine embroidery. I'm Lina here with my co-host Amanne, chatting with talented embroiders and artists sharing their stories, inspirations, and the cultural significance behind their work.
Amanne: Today we are joined by our 1st sister Duo. We have Sisters Jennifer and Christine, who we actually met at the Tetris retreat last year at Yosemite. Christine is an amateur Tatreez-er, sports enthusiast and aspiring casual crafter. Jennifer is also an amateur Tatreez-er and an avid cooker and homemaker y'all we'll talk about
Amanne: the cooking, because, like, yeah, I need homemade homemade ought to be bread, just saying that.
Amanne: Welcome to Tetris. Talk, Jennifer and Christine. We are so excited to have you both here
Jennifer: Thank you. We're so excited to be here
Christine: We are! Hi!
Amanne: Hey!
Lina: Amazing amazing
Christine: You guys
Lina: Yeah.
Amanne: Good.
Lina: A while
Amanne: I know it's crazy, too, because, like Christine and I live like what an hour away, not even an hour away from each other, and
Christine: Yeah.
Amanne: We still haven't seen each other busy, busy, busy bees!
Lina: Well, amazing, amazing. Yeah, yeah, you guys, will, we're going to figure that part out. I mean, it shouldn't be that difficult. But Jennifer and Christine. Thank you again for being on here with us. We always like to kick off with getting to know about you and your family's connection to Palestine. Maybe, Jennifer, would you like to go first, and then, Christine? You can kind of follow
Jennifer: Sure.
Jennifer: So our grandpa on our dad's side, was born in Acre Akka, in Palestine in 1928. So he lived there the 1st 20 years of his life, and he and
Jennifer: at 2 of his best friends and 2 of his siblings.
Jennifer: Well, all of his siblings left. He had 4, but we grew up with him and his 2 sisters and 2 of his best friends. So
Jennifer: you know, they lived in Akka. They in 1948, with the Nakba he
Jennifer: walked to Beirut to escape the militia in his city and kind of started over there. He
Jennifer: started working as a travel agent and then an airline salesman. He worked for Middle East Airlines for a long time, which was the Lebanese, is the Lebanese national
Jennifer: airline, and eventually transferred his job to San Francisco. So when he was living there, he met our grandma and
Jennifer: raised his family in the San Francisco Bay Area, and
Jennifer: and so our dad is one of his kids, half Palestinian and and then
Jennifer: you have us and our our brother there.
Jennifer: Yeah.
Christine: Christine, do you wanna add anything?
Christine: Yeah. So we I mean, we grew up knowing that we are Palestinian. Knowing where we were from. We have some pictures of our dad and our uncle visiting Beirut when they were, you know, 2 or 3 really really young, and our aunts and our grandpa spoke Arabic, but we never learned. I remember
Christine: when I was it. It must have been, you know, 2 or 3 reading like a picture book of numbers like counting one to 10, and my grandpa would count in English and in Arabic, and of course, then I lost it after that. But
Christine: you know, grew up being.
Christine: I can speak for myself somewhat of a picky eater, but still being fed Palestinian food by our great aunt, she was the the one who, I think, sparked the cooking in both of us, at least the Palestinian part of it. Very like, you know, we're making a salad. How much of this should I put in? And she says, Well, how much do you think like that type of thing? So yeah, we. That's that's we grew up knowing them. And we have,
Christine: cousins on our
Christine: and on other Palestinian cousins who we grew up meeting and knowing. And and yeah, that's that's our connection.
Jennifer: Yeah, and I,
Lina: Oh, sorry!
Jennifer: Sorry. No, our
Jennifer: our grandpa passed away in 1995, so we were both very young. But Christine especially just had this like
Jennifer: connection with I don't know. Like little kids sometimes
Christine: A little bit hand and feed me dinner. And yeah, you know, we we had a connection. I have very clear memories of him, even though. I was 4 when he died. So yeah, that's where my connection started.
Jennifer: And
Lina: That's so beautiful. I also like the great aunt with the
Lina: there's like no clear recipes. Why, why are people like this
Amanne: So relatable. Oh, my God, you guys, when I 1st moved out and I moved to La. And I was like, Okay, I have to like start cooking for myself, like properly. And I asked, my mom, can you like write down my favorite like, recipes of my favorite foods? And she's like, yeah, I got you literally in the on the 1st page of this little notebook, she wrote. There are no proper measurements. You're a Palestinian. You'll just figure it out like I was like, what
Christine: I will say I'm gonna stand with the aunties and with all of our parents and grandparents like that's frustrating. And you know there's a lot of trial and error, but like that teaches you to cook like it does.
Christine: I'm gonna I'm gonna stand on the side of. They're they're correct. I will say
Amanne: Also Khalto Christine. Okay.
Jennifer: Okay. But here's the thing, too. This is a this is a Christine thing, because
Amanne: It is.
Jennifer: I cannot for the life of me, salt by taste, like you remember, at the Retreat we'd be cooking, and I'd be like Christine like, I need. I need your like.
Jennifer: your ability. Like.
Jennifer: yeah, you are the. You are the one who can do this like I did not get it
Amanne: She got the Khalto Jean, you did not
Christine: Be decisive, and if you get it wrong you'll get it right next time. That's all.
Amanne: Okay.
Christine: Learn.
Amanne: I love it. So you guys like clearly had like food was one of the ways that you guys clearly connected to your Palestinian heritage. What other aspects of Palestinian culture were a part of your life? And did you guys also? Because I know you guys grew up in the Bay area, and there is a fairly large Palestinian community here. But did you guys grow up within the Palestinian community outside of like your immediate family
Jennifer: Not really so. Our grandpa was very involved in it, but, like I said, we were fairly young when he passed away, but his best friend was our dad's godfather, and they together did a lot with, like the Arab American Chamber of Commerce and us omen, and Anera in kind of the sixties, seventies, eighties. And so, like.
Jennifer: we grew up hearing names of like all their friends, and like, I went
Jennifer: to elementary school with a kid. And you know, that was just an acquaintance of mine. But my dad was like, Oh, his grandpa was really good friends with grandpa right like. So we kind of had this like
Jennifer: very light connection. But we didn't see people often. It was more in stories.
Jennifer: Yeah. So it was a little bit removed. And I think that
Jennifer: leads a lot into our to truth journey and like why we.
Jennifer: you know, kind of have been looking for
Jennifer: ways to connect is because we are like a generation removed. And we did hear these stories that we didn't necessarily
Jennifer: have our own experiences. And so, yeah, I think I think that's been almost integral to our journey, is just remembering.
Jennifer: You know.
Jennifer: our dad's so nostalgic like about everything in life. And so we have all these like family dinners where he'll just tell stories about people, and maybe we don't know them, but it kind of has inspired us to know who we are. Right
Christine: Yeah, and that definitely. And then I think the other part of it actually
Christine: of your question is, the other part of our journey into the trees is the other parts of Palestine. So our our aunt, who lived near us was a prolific crocheter, and she did lace tatting and other things, but so she made each of us. Yeah, she was a seamstress, she like prolific and very talented, and she made all of her
Christine: nieces and nephews, blankets, and she made our my, our dad and our aunt
Christine: things growing up. And and yeah, like a talented seamstress. And so we have these hand-me-downs from her. We she made all of our Christmas stockings, which we'll get back to later, because that like ended up in my to trees journey, but it was never to trees. But she did have all these things that she made and passed on to us. That were very, I think important to us like
Christine: I brought. I think, Jennifer, you have your blanket in Boston. I brought mine to college with me, and when I lived in Connecticut like. So there are things that stick with us and have come with us. And so we never had that weird like I had said. I'm an aspiring like Crafter, that I want to now make these things that I can keep and have and bring me joy, and that you can pass to other people. So that was the other part of us. Connecting was the other things that we saw
Amanne: Always always work with your hands. I'm noticing the cooking, the threes, the crocheting all right. Your ancestors were busy with their hands.
Jennifer: Yeah. Well, I I
Jennifer: was reading a Tatreez book, and I don't remember what book it was, but it said something about how like
Jennifer: in Nazareth was like a center, for, like almost like homemaking, like you knew like, if your wife was from Nazareth, she was going to be so good at all of these things right? And that is where our great grandma's from. And so, like, I, literally, I'm like.
Jennifer: we also grew up Mormon. And so I grew up with this like aspiring to be basically a professional homemaker. It's always what I wanted to do, and I always thought of it as being like a stay at home, wife and mother from like that lens
Jennifer: But then, as I got older, like our aunt, who did all this homemaking like, and was taught by her mother from Nazareth right like all these crafts, all these
Jennifer: yeah things that you do with your hands. She never married. She never wanted to get married like
Jennifer: it wasn't about that it wasn't about taking on a role as a woman or a wife, as a mother. It was about like
Jennifer: preserving your culture with your hands, making things
Jennifer: to know who you are, to pass on to future generations, not necessarily like your direct descendants, or even blood descendants. Right? But just to like.
Jennifer: yeah, really preserve your culture, and who you are in this world and your place like as an individual. And so that has been really meaningful for me as an adult, and as I I mean, my adult life has been very different from the kind of like Mormon stay at home. Mom
Jennifer: dream I had as a teenager, or whatever right like I'm you know I've been.
Jennifer: I'm in my mid thirties like, I'm getting married this year, right? And yeah. But like I I've lived my most of my adult life like single. And
Jennifer: and I feel like it's been really amazing to have these role models of people who did this for themselves and their own identity. And you know it doesn't have to be. How you make a living like the important thing is that it's
Jennifer: it's for you, right?
Jennifer: It's for your culture and your place in the world.
Christine: Yeah. And then I think along those lines, sorry to cut you off, but like, it's also just that the culture of like taking care of people and taking care of your family and feeding them with literal food, and also, you know, with giving them what you can make with your hands and and building that family again. Blood, and not, like all of those things, tie into it, and and are how we were raised, even though we weren't necessarily as
Christine: like directly connected, or in the Palestinian community like, we still learned all those things and brought all those things with us to our adulthood. So
Jennifer: Yeah. And like, speaking of taking care of people.
Jennifer: my, our dad, in the last
Jennifer: later years of our great aunt's life, had this like constant fight with her, where, like she she couldn't have us over without feeding us like it was
Amanne: Yeah.
Jennifer: Not like in her their abilities to like, have people.
Jennifer: her house, especially family, especially like the grannies and nephew like, without giving food as care. And so, as she got older, like, she had 2 knee replacements right and like she was like
Jennifer: walking to mass every morning right? And as soon as she couldn't do that, she had her like Vhs. Of mass that she put in at 7 Am. Every day right and like like she needed to be like doing all of these things that were important to her. But one of them was feeding us right, and so like we would go over, and he would. He would be like.
Jennifer: We're going to in-n-out Burger. The kids are really excited about it, so you can't cook like he would find like these reasons right then we would get there, and she would be like I made a cake right
Christine: It would be like, Don't cook. And she'd be like, Okay, and then we'd get there, and she would have cooked so like
Jennifer: Yeah, you know. Yeah.
Jennifer: But it was like, very good natured like at the same time. Of all of this, right? Like
Christine: Oh, yeah.
Jennifer: They planted grape vines in our backyard when we were teenagers for the leaves for her right, like they
Amanne: Of course.
Jennifer: Like there was
Jennifer: there was. It wasn't that, you know, there wasn't support for her during this. But just like, you know, we know you're getting older, we want
Jennifer: easier for you. But like there was no.
Jennifer: there was no world in which, like caring with your hands, and with something like very physical, was not going to be part of her relationship with us. Right?
Amanne: Very beautifully said very beautifully said, so I think that kind of is the perfect trajectory. To start talking about your Tetris journeys, which you guys have kind of mentioned. So both of you are newer in your Tetris journey. And you guys have kind of been on this journey together. So can we kind of start? Maybe, like Christine, if you want to kind of kick us off and maybe tell us about like.
Amanne: why, the threes like what inspired you to even like start the threes learn about the threes. Where did that kind of like relationship begin
Christine: Yeah, I can start, but I'm very quickly going to pass it to Jennifer also because I feel like she started even before that. But it was for me, after October 7.th I was really looking for connection and things to read and listen to, and and just any sort of community, because I was
Christine: feeling a certain way. And I just need. And I actually, it must have just come up in a feed of mine that I found to trees talk the podcast and so I started listening to your podcast and I just enjoyed hearing from you guys and from your guests, which was sometimes about to trees and sometimes just about their life or their local community Palestinian community, wherever they were like worldwide. Because I know you, there's been guests from everywhere on. And so I was just listening, and that, like I
Christine: I don't even know if I had a thought of. Maybe I want to try that I literally was just listening for.
Christine: the the community of it all. And then I got again. We can go back to Jennifer, but I just on I got. She DM'd me on Twitter one day, and she was like I think we should do, or she was like, I want to do a to trees, retreat, and sent me the link to the to trees retreat.
Christine: And I looked at it. And I was like, Wait. I know these girls, I listen to their podcast so that was the start of it, like, very independently that we found you. But Jennifer had, like known of the trees, and I don't know that you had started doing it before that, but like you had seen an exhibit and stuff before that
Jennifer: Yeah, so my journey, Lena, I kind of. I have always liked hearing your story, because I also learned cross stitch like as a child in a completely different context. I learned
Jennifer: we did like a sampler at a church event when I was like 8 years old, and that was my 1st exposure to it. I don't think I ever finished that sampler, and it like sat in a closet for years and years. And then
Jennifer: there was one year in my twenties when I was like
Jennifer: like kind of short on, like
Jennifer: money approaching Christmas. And like I was like, what do I get from my parents that like they.
Jennifer: you know, that
Jennifer: mean something coming from me when, like they had been like helping me out that year, and things like this. And so
Jennifer: We had done like a family photo
Jennifer: shoot recently. And so I
Jennifer: I found someone on Etsy who would make a cross stitch pattern out of a photo. And so I just sent her this picture, and she made a pattern of like our family. And so that fall I like did my 1st like cross stitching in earnest, and I watched, I think, like all of Grey's anatomy up to that point so like that tells you how long cross stitching takes? Right? It's like 19 seasons, or whatever at the time. And so
Jennifer: but yeah. So I gave my parents this little you know, cross stitch
Jennifer: picture of the 5 of us. And then I just didn't think about cross stitch for many years. And then I think it was early in 2023.
Jennifer: My housemate who just in general is very thoughtful about like finding art like art events.
Jennifer: that her friends might be interested in like I do ballet classes sometimes, and so she'll like often be like, do you want to go to the ballet with me right? And so she's very good at just like finding
Jennifer: yeah, like events that her friends are interested in. She was like, Oh, there's this you know, Palestinian art exhibit. That's gonna be at the Contemporary Art Museum in Boston.
Jennifer: we should go. And so we went, and it was
Jennifer: a Jordan Nassar Tetris exhibit. He does these like beautiful like wall sized pieces, and
Jennifer: so you know I was there. I was taking pictures and sending them to the family group. Chat right? And so
Jennifer: you know, I think this is maybe like spring 2023 and so then, like Christine said.
Jennifer: after October 7, th she was getting interested in Palestinian craft, and Tetris was part of that and other just like Palestinian culture. So I think, because I had sent her these pictures. She
Jennifer: for Christmas got me I feel like Christmas gifts like continue to be part of our like touch base journey. But she got me this poster
Jennifer: of from the dark collective of like a bunch of different motifs.
Jennifer: just like, hey? I know, you liked this exhibit. Here's
Jennifer: something you can put on your wall at home.
Jennifer: and yeah, that was right before you guys started your podcast. In January, and she started listening. And Lena, you've somehow made made it onto my like Instagram feed. And I got the link like we just when I text or message her on Twitter. We were like, how did we hear about this separately, in terms of like Tetris talk in the retreat? But that's when
Jennifer: we both were like, Okay, we're gonna do this like this is in, you know, at the time this is gonna be in like
Jennifer: 8 months or something, right? So we're gonna
Jennifer: buy some kits. We're gonna learn to do this. And we both did the same
Jennifer: bees and poppies. Kit, I like I brought like all these little
Amanne: So it honestly, it's so. It's so pretty. I really
Jennifer: I,
Amanne: Pattern.
Jennifer: I love it so much. Christine, do you? I I really should have
Amanne: We can link it in the show notes
Jennifer: Yeah, well.
Amanne: Give me that
Jennifer: To that, as you
Amanne: It is.
Jennifer: This this pattern makers lovely
Christine: Oh, she's wonderful.
Christine: Yeah.
Amanne: We love that you like
Christine: Need extra needles, because I couldn't find needles that I liked, and the one that she said I love so like she's wonderful
Jennifer: Yeah, she was like, I buy these in bulk, so I don't know where you can get them. So let me just send you some
Amanne: Relatable.
Christine: And yeah, they're they're wonderful.
Jennifer: Yeah, so yeah, so we both did this pattern to learn. And
Jennifer: Then I I bought some linen and
Jennifer: started trying designing for a thobe which is an ongoing ongoing project! But
Lina: We understand, we
Jennifer: As you as you might know.
Jennifer: yeah. And kind of the rest is history.
Jennifer: we both kind of fell in love with it.
Christine: Yeah. And that's so. I was still working on my starter kit at the Retreat. I don't even think I finished it. I think I finished it like 3 days after I got home, which I was sad about. But
Jennifer: I thought you got there. But just after the
Christine: No, but I had realized. So I I mentioned our our Christmas stockings that our great aunt had made us, and I had always so like my friend. My best friend has a baby, and it this past Christmas was her 1st Christmas.
Christine: and once she was trying to have a baby, or like talking about it. I was like, I want to like. I had these stockings for my aunt, and I like want to be the aunt who like makes her Christmas stocking if you like, don't have any other plans, and she was like, No, go ahead. And so I was looking at ours, and I realized that they're crocheted. But they have
Christine: like the designs are stitched into them.
Jennifer: Crossed.
Christine: They're like, Yeah, cross stitch. And so they're like Christmas trees and ornaments and stuff. And so I was like, this is perfect, like, I can crochet the stocking and then to trees onto it. Now that I know what I know what I'm doing, now that I've learned a little bit. And so that was my project this past winter. Which was, it? Was so fun to like.
Christine: examine, like inside and out, and like over and over again. I was like sending pictures to like our family, and I think, even like
Christine: No, I think even some girls from the to trees retreat like I was sending pictures and being like, who can help me with this? And it was so much fun, and like definitely used a lot of things that I learned from people on the retreat and like design, software and stuff to like, figure out the space of what I was doing. It did not turn out perfectly.
Christine: I it was honestly the crocheting that messed it up. It was not the 2 trees, but but yeah, so that kind of was like our next, and and after being at the Retreat, then I kind of was like, I want to do trees on everything like I. You know, we've done these kits that are on Ida. But there were so many different creative outlets of people doing different things that I saw and and I can talk a little bit about that creativity that you were talking about, and many of like.
Christine: I don't consider myself to be a creative person. I never have. It's always been like a struggle, but I am interested in crafting, and I like having these things made with my hands, and just the something about to trees has like stuck with me. I've tried other things before, like even the crocheting which I've done like a few very small things, but when I was doing it. It's like I. There's something about it that clicks with my brain. It's it's very meditative. The spatial reasoning of like.
Christine: where am I starting? And where am I going? And not that, like the back, has to be perfect. I would never aspire to having a back that looks like a manny's back. But but just the space reasoning of like, of how to do it is something that really just scratches this itch in my brain that works really well. And so
Amanne: I'm like all the snaps. Yes, I relate to everything you're saying. Oh, my God!
Christine: And like, you know, like good for you like it's good for your brain and and it. And it's this thing where, like I've tried like watercoloring, and I just like I look at a blank page, and I'm just like I don't know. But when I have done the very few to trees designs that I like. I have ideas, and I think like, Oh, I could do it this way, and I could do this color. And I could put this here and that like it. It does like activate it for me, which is
Christine: again, as someone who does not. That does not come naturally to me at all. It's been like wonderful for me. So yeah.
Jennifer: I think it's so funny that you say you're not creative because I feel like you're just
Jennifer: I mean, you're you're in a creative career. You're you're doing all of this all the time.
Christine: That we have, but it's fine
Amanne: I will say every
Amanne: every single artist that I have met has told me it's really difficult for them like it took a long time for them to call themselves an artist, and it takes a long time for creatives to like. Admit that they are creative. I I completely relate to you, Christine.
Lina: But I'll is. Christina is the Khalto who doesn't need a recipe. That is
Amanne: I know the enemy of creativity. I know that's like
Amanne: a little bit of a detour. But can we detour a little bit, and can we talk about the fact that
Christine: Yeah.
Amanne: Christine and Jennifer cooked us up like not just a meal. Multiple meals like we were in the mountains of Yosemite. We were literally in the middle of nowhere. We didn't plan for like any cooking or anything like that.
Amanne: and like literally making things from scratch like I'm like, how did you? How do we
Lina: For how many.
Amanne: Pita bread.
Lina: We weren't like 20
Jennifer: You were like 1819,
Amanne: Yeah.
Christine: Team, right?
Christine: Yeah.
Jennifer: My favorite, though, about this. So 1st of all, there was
Jennifer: so fun, it was so much fun, and like definitely like multiple people like as soon as we like had the idea multiple people were like, yes, and like, put, you know, like I had never. There were things I had never like made before that I learned right? Like,
Jennifer: yeah, like, Bayan's lentil soup was like
Jennifer: Her 3adas was amazing. And you know, Amal, like, came with us on the shopping trip to make sure that, like we had
Jennifer: everything and you know, to like
Christine: Should we
Jennifer: Or
Christine: Like Amal, just like whipped up some kafta she was like, I'm just gonna make like
Jennifer: Yeah.
Christine: Very casually.
Amanne: Yeah.
Christine: We're contributing today
Jennifer: But honestly, my favorite contribution was Paige. I don't remember the name of the show that she would talk about, but there's like a cooking show where there's like 3 levels. Of how many resources you have, Imani, when you talked about like we're in the mountains. And it's like you're competing 3 groups competing with each other, and some people have, like top of the line, like perfect kitchen, everything you could ever want, amazing stove whatever. And some people have like a wooden spoon like we were definitely and like
Christine: In that kitchen
Jennifer: Yeah, we were like we made the oh, we made the maklouba, and like a
Jennifer: in like 3 small pods, and one of them like didn't have flat handles. So we're like doing all these things and like the most creative ways possible. And I like everyone's just coming in together and like thinking of, you know, how can we like
Jennifer: get this blender to like process this much soup like? So I mean, I just, I love the
Jennifer: It was just like the ultimate food bringing people together. Experience, experience.
Amanne: Yeah, no, it definitely.
Amanne: It definitely was. It was it was. It was such a good time which
Amanne: we'll talk about more more about that but I guess also, I mean again, it does tie into your journey because you guys did decide to come on this retreat, as you were like, kind of newer into this world of Tetris. And I'm curious, like what that
Amanne: was like for you guys, because this was probably the 1st like community you interacted with. You know. And all these new face like literally, there was there was 19 of us. So it's like all these new faces. What was that experience like for you guys?
Jennifer: I I will say more than it being like a tree's community like
Jennifer: I don't know that I had ever been around so many Palestinians. And like I,
Jennifer: just completely Palestinian community like not that everyone in the group was Palestinian, but just that like like
Jennifer: that was the focus of the community, right? And you know we have.
Jennifer: like a few elders in our family, right? And you know a few distant cousins that we've like seen throughout our life, but like
Jennifer: to be around so many Palestinians, and to be around so much like Arabic spoken. We were like constantly asking people like, Wait like I,
Jennifer: what does that word mean? Like? I've never heard that word in that context before, right like, you know, our family might say like yellow, or like Habibi, but like not like
Jennifer: even our dad like, didn't learn Arabic right? And so that experience of being in a completely Palestinian community for a week
Jennifer: was, it was just completely new, and it just felt like home in a way that
Jennifer: you know, was, it's just almost impossible to describe
Christine: It's so hard to describe like it's so hard to describe. And I will say, like I was nervous.
Christine: because I also like it sounds crazy like that. There were 19 of us, and we've never been in a group of that many Palestinians. But like it's true. And and I was nervous because of that, and because of the fact that we had had just started learning how to entries. But like
Christine: just the
Christine: we've talked about this like the instant connection, the instant like sisterhood with all these women. And like,
Christine: was, yeah, just so hard to describe, like being in that environment, being in that environment for a week like it was just so. Very like healing and nourishing like just it was amazing. And then, just in the same vein of what I was talking about like like to trees, wise like
Christine: I had just started learning. I don't do a lot of these crafts, or I haven't throughout my life, and like seeing all the different ways that people applied it, what they were to freezing, on which motifs they were choosing, and the colors and the different like. I said, like ways that people designed and and ways
Christine: the tools that they use, all the different like lighting and like elements. I feel like when I got home. I bought like the lights, so I could do it, because I have, like, you know, dim light in my house, and just just everything seeing it all was so.
Christine: inspiring like I like. I said I came home wanting to treat to trees on everything and and having all these ideas come up of like, oh, I can do this, I can do that. I can make this stocking for my my. I call my niece, and something that she'll have, that she can treasure and and all. Yeah, I just it was so. It was great
Lina: Oh, that's so powerful! So if you had to describe Jennifer and Christine Pre-tatreez and post-tatreez, how would you guys describe yourselves
Christine: Is okay, like, I don't want to be like hyperbolic. I really don't want to be hyperbolic or like crazy. But like, I really feel like it has like instilled this like
Christine: confidence in a way of like something that has really just like resonated with me, and has felt very natural to me like the to trees itself. And then also, like
Christine: starting to be more involved in this community and talking to people and and that like it. It's just like, yeah. Been very like grounding, I guess. Maybe in a way. I have
Christine: because we've grown up like
Christine: a generation removed and and not have, like the very close connection I feel like there has always been this little like nagging thing of like not really knowing where to start, and where to get in, and how to feel connected to this part of myself that I consider so very important, and I feel like it's not to use the word connected. This thread like of starting and like, been like, okay, like, I have this, I can be in this. I can start here and like go forward from here.
Christine: you know, not to be like
Christine: so sincere about it. But but like that's how I feel
Amanne: We like sincere.
Jennifer: Yeah, I think for me. You know, in in the
Jennifer: in the earlier years, of my adulthood, I,
Jennifer: there were a lot of academic ways that I tried to connect to our Palestinian history.
Jennifer: not just the Palestinian side, but all sides of our family have always been very like.
Jennifer: focused on family history. Obviously the Mormon Church is a huge center for that, but also our other, like our Palestinian grandpa's wife, that Grandma
Jennifer: was very interested in it, just
Jennifer: on her own right. And I grew up thinking about like, if you journal like, what will that teach future generations and about how to record history and all of these things. And then, when I got to college, I studied international relations with a focus in Middle East studies. And I did my like undergraduate thesis on the Palestinian diaspora, and
Jennifer: I feel like there was still a level of
Jennifer: remove. You know I mean it not that those pieces of learning, those ways of learning and knowing aren't
Jennifer: so important. Right? And I have.
Jennifer: you know, professors from college who
Jennifer: I'm like so grateful to you to this day for helping me
Jennifer: understand how to connect. You know certain historical events and
Jennifer: understand where I come from, and all of these things right. But I think that
Jennifer: 2 things with with the trees like it's first.st It's an embodied way of knowing right. And so, on the one hand, you have all of these
Jennifer: like physical things that other people have made. You have the material culture that they've created and passed down, whether it's the actual like pieces of art, or like the tools, right? Like we have our aunts like laced hatting tool, which, like.
Jennifer: you know, maybe someday I will
Jennifer: be so ambitious as to learn that craft which is so
Jennifer: so detailed and and just difficult. But
Jennifer: but yeah, it's an embodied way of knowing, but it's also such a communal way of knowing. And
Jennifer: it it seems
Jennifer: it's just almost always so based in a circle, right like in sitting down with other people to stitch and to show each other, and to communicate with each other like in that moment, but also communicate through time, and I think that it has just
Jennifer: fleshed out and rounded out.
Jennifer: The ways of knowing that
Jennifer: connect me to like our Palestinian heritage. In a way, I think when we say things are hard to describe or impossible to describe. It's because it is beyond language, right? There are
Jennifer: other ways of knowing, and I'm I'm such a language
Jennifer: lover, right like I'm so interested in literature and history, and writing as ways of passing things down. But
Jennifer: it is not everything. And so I think. To trace has been a really important way of
Jennifer: bringing the physical and communal ways of knowing about our culture and heritage into my life.
Amanne: Okay, I love what you said about journaling. And like this being kind of like the story that people people wind up reading that led me to this idea of like
Amanne: Tetris traditionally, is a form of storytelling, and obviously I know both of you are still very new. And what, hopefully, is a very long Tetris journey. But starting with you, Jennifer, and then, Christine, I'd love to hear from you as well. What would you say? At least as you are now like. What is the story that you want to leave behind with your Tetris?
Jennifer: I I would say, that
Jennifer: the the benefit of of Tetris and
Jennifer: other craft as storytelling is how slowly you can put together the story. And when I started working on designs for my thobe, it's
Jennifer: I I started like a folder on my computer, right where I'm I'm just listing like.
Jennifer: you know, I could use acorns and oak leaves because we grew up like at the foot of Mount Diablo, in the Bay area, where there's
Jennifer: oak trees everywhere, right like, and that's 1 thing that's an embodied memory from my childhood that I could leave on a thobe right? And oh, well, now I found this poppies pattern that I think could represent both Palestine and California to me, and just like, little by little, over time, as I learn more. I can just kind of sash these things away, and it doesn't have to be overnight that I create this thobe. So it's not the story of one moment in my life. It's not
Jennifer: the story of one day. It's the story of what has stuck with me over time, and it's the story of what has stood out to me, and
Jennifer: in so many ways. You don't know why certain things stand out, and there's almost a poetry to it, and to be able to leave something behind where someone can say, well, I wonder why this
Jennifer: was important to this person, or maybe they don't even know. You know, with material crafts you never know. Maybe someone ends up with it who doesn't know who you were and doesn't even know who it was that left this. But they they see it and think, oh, there was like
Jennifer: a human who had a human experience of this
Jennifer: motif meaning something to them. I wonder why? Right. And
Jennifer: so I think the ability to leave a story that
Jennifer: that pulls out all of those individual moments from a long period of time that is by its nature put together slowly that there's no way to just snap your fingers and have it. I think that's really beautiful. And of all of the stories that I might leave behind in various ways in my life. I think that's going to be the unique thing about the Tatreez story
Christine: Can you tell that Jennifer is the one who's really good at language? She just puts things so beautifully.
Christine: yeah, I I haven't really thought about it. Very much. And I think
Christine: what what I can say about it right now is kind of
Christine: just like we've talked about how you know our, how the growing up in our family, and like the different things that we've done across a bunch of stuff like has has contributed to how we are now, and one of those things specifically is.
Christine: is like hand-me-downs, like
Christine: Jennifer said, like all parts of our family, have been very interested in family history, and we've been so lucky that that's the case that we know a lot about our history. And even though we may not know those people. We didn't meet them. We don't know them specifically, personally, like we
Christine: have hand-me-downs from people in our family. And and again, that includes, like our blood family, and also our wider, just like community family.
Christine: And so I think I it just goes back to the same
Christine: concept as like the the Christmas stockings are big for me like that was something like we all have them. We have them every year like we don't talk about it that much, but like those were from our great aunt. And and I was like, I want to be the one for my personal relationships like my now one year old niece like that. She has that for me that she knows that I was thinking about her, and I wanted to make it for her and and
Christine: Sometimes it would be explicitly that that I, you know, make things for other people, but also the things that I make for myself. Just it definitely is like you never know who will end up with things and who will end up like
Christine: reading your story, learning your story. But like
Christine: just, I want anyone who is in my circle, and my family like to to see any pieces from me, and and know like oh, like. She was interested in this, and she made this or she and she had like I I like things
Christine: in gifts and in all sorts of things like things that are used every day like so this is part of why, when I look at what other people are to tracing like
Christine: like a jean jacket, or I have this purse that I wanted to trees like things that I will use and come in contact with every day, and that's like some of the hand-me-downs that I have from people in my family are, you know, a picture that was on the wall in our grandma's house that now I have in my like. It's that type of connection of like this was part of their everyday life.
Christine: And now I can like keep it to be part of my everyday life and like, remember them. If that makes sense, I think that's like the story of like
Christine: everyday items, things that are special but also can be special and mundane at the same time, or or common, or just integrated in and out of, like. Everything we do, are the types of things that I hope to tell my story
Lina: Oh!
Jennifer: Yeah. And I think
Jennifer: if I can jump off of that a little bit, I'm sorry. I just I think about it, too, as as our personal relationships across time. Right? I think a lot of times. You know, it's 2025.
Jennifer: it's it's been, you know, 77 years since the Nakba that sounds like a long time. But
Jennifer: we had personal relationships with these 5 people that we knew like in person.
Jennifer: But then, even more than that, right like
Jennifer: our great aunt that we've been talking about, she passed away in 2015.
Jennifer: But, Christine, you have those crocheted coasters of hers that are on your coffee table every single day, and
Jennifer: you know you can see those and remember her. But also it's something that you touch every day that at 1 point she was touching every day. And when I think about
Jennifer: you know how long a hundred years, or even something like 500 years seems. But then, if you think about how many people
Jennifer: you know, if you think about like our great aunt, knowing her great grandparents, or something like that, or like her grandparents.
Jennifer: we're a lot closer to things that sound like they were a long time ago than
Jennifer: people often like to think and to realize that you have a personal relationship with someone who had a personal relationship with someone else
Jennifer: who was born 200 years ago.
Jennifer: You know, these things that seem so far away from us are still
Jennifer: with us, and I think those material objects are such a good reminder of that
Lina: That is so powerful. Thank you. Guys, this is, I'm like, kind of in awe, thinking it's making me think about all the things that have been passed down to me and kind of who else has been has been using them or working on them? It's it's a really crazy thought to think about, even though it's yeah, like you said, we're not as far as we think that we are from from previous generations, from
Lina: yeah, I yeah, so I guess.
Lina: What are we working on right now? I get Christine, are you still working on the stocking, Jennifer? What are you? What are your projects as well, would love to hear about the the works in in progress
Christine: Yeah. The stocking came in under the finish line. It was done before Christmas, so she had it for Christmas. I'm working on from that same. Well, now, I can't remember if it was the same shop, but another pattern that I got on. Etsy. It's a flower garden pattern, which again I'll send, and you can link, which is so beautiful. And I,
Christine: after being at the Retreat and seeing everybody's thobes, I now have this seed in my head. That's like I could make like. It will definitely be a long, you know. Long journey. But I now I'm eventually I'm like I would love to make a thobe it would, it would be great. But yeah, right now, just another pattern designed beautifully by somebody. And like I said, I have
Christine: Now that I have a little bit of practice with like different motifs, and looking up different motifs and things like, I have this bag that I want to that I wanted to trees and and stuff. So those are.
Christine: That's that's the plan going forward
Jennifer: I'm a little bit back to the drawing board on the designing part of my thought, but I just as I started stitching, there were things actually listening to. The truth has been helpful because I don't remember what episode it was, or someone was saying like.
Jennifer: It's
Jennifer: you make a design. You might not like it until you finish it, and you see it. And then you realize that no, this is what I really
Jennifer: wanted. And so I'm like having a moment about. You know. I've been going back to the drawing board and trying to change some things, and and just kind of finding that space of confidence to kind of move forward. I also just signed up for a sigh about making class with Samia
Jennifer: for
Jennifer: I knew that I would not have time before I get married to
Jennifer: stitch something to wear. But I will have a sigh of belt for at least some part of the
Jennifer: of the festivities that weekend so that that's I've been picking out fabric for that and working on that
Jennifer: as well. And then on the community side of things. I am
Jennifer: trying to work on getting consistent. Tatreez circles meeting here in Boston. There is a little bit of an interested community. And so that's something I will also
Jennifer: have you guys link in the
Jennifer: in the show is our
Amanne: Yeah, please.
Jennifer: Fasting centuries, group
Amanne: Yeah, please, do. I know if anyone's listening who is in the Boston area who's not already connected to Jennifer? We'll definitely get you guys connected. So you can kind of continue to grow that community locally, because I know that
Amanne: local communities are such a lifeline, especially when things are crazy in the real world. Sometimes you need to disassociate. But with people who are like-minded, who, you know people, you can be safe with
Jennifer: Yes.
Amanne: Oh, amazing! I mean, you guys, this has been so so powerful and so beautiful to like. Listen to both of you guys speak and honestly to to be a part of both of your journeys as well like
Amanne: it's it's really great to see I'm excited to have you guys come back to the Tatreez Retreat like a whole year later, and like, see the growth in your journeys. And kind of see what you guys are working on at that point. But before we say goodbye, we do like to ask.
Amanne: what are any major life lessons that you have gained from Tetris? So maybe, Christine, do you want to kick off
Christine: Sure. Maybe it's like very common. And but patience obviously is a big one.
Christine: I think not only patience in the time that it takes to create the art in a bunch of different ways, but definitely
Christine: from mistakes in again, multiple ways, just the patience of like learning something new. It's very like cliche, but like to start something and then just be like, well, I can't do this perfectly right now. So to like, have this
Christine: this like inclination to maybe put it down. But the fact that, like it, has resonated so much with me just to to keep like going back and starting again and trying, and then also, in the sense of like making a mistake, have
Christine: you know, it could go multiple ways. But having the patience to undo work and redo it. You know, if you if you left a stitch or missed a stitch or something that was like multiple steps back to be like, well, I could just leave it, or I could like take the time and again, not because everything has to be perfect, but just like
Christine: that I I don't have to just keep going, going, going. I can like stop and reassess and and undo and redo, and and make sure that
Christine: things are done the the way I wanted to, and also like those things, help you learn. So patience overall is a big one in in many different ways.
Jennifer: And one thing I've learned is that Christine really does have the hut to like
Jennifer: energy. Because every time I make a mistake and I'm like undoing stitches in front of her. She's like it builds character. And anyway,
Jennifer: but also I think I think for me. It's really a new way of listening.
Jennifer: Part of my going back to the drawing board. Experience that I was talking about.
Jennifer: had to do with going to the retreat and seeing
Jennifer: all these designs? That other people had made, and learning to
Jennifer: understand either what they're communicating or why they might have made a certain decision. And
Jennifer: to really kind of sit with.
Jennifer: you know what it means to make choices about a visual medium and and to just, I mean, almost learn a new language. And it sounds.
Jennifer: I think, sometimes very, either specific or like surface level. But there's something about
Jennifer: meditating on like, why, you make a visual decision. It's it's just not a way that I'm always used to communicating. And so I think
Jennifer: that's been a big one for me.
Lina: So beautiful. Thank you, guys both for sharing. And one last question before we let you go officially for those listening. How can they best get in touch and follow your journeys. We'll obviously put in the show notes. But in case you wanna
Lina: shout out, some of them in the episode feel free to
Jennifer: I'm on Instagram. That's probably the best way. I would love to follow other Dutch users on Instagram, so my
Jennifer: handle is very annoying to find, because it starts with 2 underscores, and then nif and 2 more underscores. It's like just the middle of my 1st name, so I will give that to you to Link, because that will be much easier than anyone trying to search
Amanne: We'll link it especially again. Anyone in the Boston area is in the Boston scenario.
Amanne: Let's let's grow that community
Christine: This is maybe annoying, but I don't. I don't do a lot on social media.
Christine: I am more of a behind the scenes person. So I don't know that I really have anything to link. I will say. If you're in the Bay Area, I am making an effort to go to the tree circles. I work on the weekends a lot, and so I can't always make it. But I would love to love, to love, to go to as many of those circles as I can and meet people in the Bay Area at those circles, so you can find me there
Amanne: Christine. We're gonna have to do a weekday circle just to get
Christine: Oh, I'll be there!
Amanne: I'm out like I will, we'll talk
Amanne: about it. We'll talk, cause I'm gonna I'm gonna be moving not too far from you in a few months. So we'll talk about it. Yeah.
Amanne: alright.
Amanne: amazing. Well, thank you both so much for joining us like we obviously had a blast chatting with you guys, and
Amanne: so beautiful to hear about your journey, and again to be a part of it and see it continue to grow. So we'll have to be back. We'll have to have you guys both back when you're Jennifer. When you're done with your thobe and Christine when you're like starting your thobe, so we'll we'll continue the conversation for sure. But thank you guys so much for being here. We'll talk to you guys both soon
Jennifer: Thank you. It was so lovely to talk great to see you guys
Christine: Good to see you
Lina: Such a pleasure to talk to Jennifer and Christine about their journeys. It's interesting, because, although we got to know them a little bit more intimately. It's different than having like this one on one conversation and hearing more about
Lina: kind of their relationship to their family members, and how that is an extension to Philistine, and
Lina: and it just goes to show like top trees is one of those things. It is kind of like cooking, except it's a lot slower of an experience. But it is one of those things that you're able to tap into, that maybe doesn't require you to be physically there for you to speak the language for you to have kind of that firsthand experience. So it was so beautiful to kind of hear them describe their relationship to each other to themselves, to their family members, as kind of got introduced to them as well. I love that
Amanne: Yeah, I had so many more questions. We I was just trying to be mindful of time. But yeah, like, I think I could have continued to just talk to them for hours and hours about this, and we'll be doing that again this year. That the retreat so I'll get those questions answered, but it was really great to hear from them, you know, and
Amanne: and hear about the fact that both of them are still so new in their journeys. And like.
Amanne: I feel like there's been so much transformation for them, like, even like, you know. And this is not like, Yeah, I need tuning our own horn, and like advertising, and all this stuff for like the retreat. But like I never even thought about the fact as they said, like, this was the 1st time they were around this many Palestinians like outside of their family, right? Which is like for somebody who, like me, who had the privilege of being around a large.
Amanne: large way, too large of a family, but also like a very large community. Like, I don't even think about that. I'm like, Oh, wow! That's like kind of crazy. And like those are all these like little things, if you will, that has brought to them in such a short amount of time like just bringing them like a whole new community. Giving them these new experiences, and like, I'm so glad to hear that they felt like this instant sisterhood with everyone, because, you know, like sometimes I think, especially like as us being like the people who are organizing it like.
Amanne: I always feel that. But again we're organizing it. So we're like hyped up. We're excited. We're like, you know, connecting with people as like the quote unquote host if you will, but knowing that other people who are brand new into the community feel that it's just, I don't know. It feels very.
Amanne: very like rewarding like, it's like, Okay, this is why we do this like, that's why we organize this like little retreat situation. So but yeah, I'm I'm really glad that we were able to chat with them and hear their story, and
Amanne: I am very excited to see what they bring with them to the retreat this year, because I know it's not going to be no beginner Kits, like our girls are going to be on it. But again, thank you all. So much for listening to Tatreez Talk as always. We want to hear about your Tatreez journey, so share your stories with us at the tatreeztalk@gmail.com. And we might have you on an upcoming
Amanne: episode. Don't forget to subscribe to the podcast on your favorite listening platform and be sure to leave us a 5 star review. You can follow me at @minamanne and Lina at @linasthobe. Follow the pod at @tatreeztalk! We'll talk to you soon.
